Help talk:Citation Style 1

This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the Help:Citation Style 1 and the CS1 templates page.

Put new text under old text. Click here to start a new topic. New to Wikipedia? Welcome! Learn to edit; get help. Assume good faith Be polite and avoid personal attacks Be welcoming to newcomers Seek dispute resolution if needed Shortcut WT:CS1WT:CS1

Archives: Index, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37, 38, 39, 40, 41, 42, 43, 44, 45, 46, 47, 48, 49, 50, 51, 52, 53, 54, 55, 56, 57, 58, 59, 60, 61, 62, 63, 64, 65, 66, 67, 68, 69, 70, 71, 72, 73, 74, 75, 76, 77, 78, 79, 80, 81, 82, 83, 84, 85, 86, 87, 88, 89, 90, 91, 92, 93, 94, 95, 96, 97, 98, 99, 100Auto-archiving period: 20 days

To help centralize discussions and keep related topics together, the talk pages for all Citation Style 1 and Citation Style 2 templates and modules redirect here. A list of those talk pages and their historical archives can be found here.

This help page does not require a rating on Wikipedia's content assessment scale. It is of interest to multiple WikiProjects.

Wikipedia Help High‑importance This page is within the scope of the Wikipedia Help Project, a collaborative effort to improve Wikipedia's help documentation for readers and contributors. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks. To browse help related resources see the Help Menu or Help Directory. Or ask for help on your talk page and a volunteer will visit you there.Wikipedia HelpWikipedia:Help ProjectTemplate:Wikipedia Help ProjectHelp High This page has been rated as High-importance on the project's importance scale. Academic Journals This page is within the scope of WikiProject Academic Journals, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of Academic Journals on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.Academic JournalsWikipedia:WikiProject Academic JournalsTemplate:WikiProject Academic JournalsAcademic Journal Magazines This page is within the scope of WikiProject Magazines, a collaborative effort to improve the coverage of magazines on Wikipedia. If you would like to participate, please visit the project page, where you can join the discussion and see a list of open tasks.MagazinesWikipedia:WikiProject MagazinesTemplate:WikiProject Magazinesmagazine See WikiProject Magazines' writing guide for tips on how to improve this article.

view · edit Frequently asked questions I would like to add a free-to-read publisher to the DOI prefix list in Module:Citation/CS1/Configuration Module:Citation/CS1/Configuration needs the 10.xxxx/... part of the DOI associated with the publisher. All the publications of the publisher must be free-to read. Once that is done, the xxxx part can be added to the list under local function build_free_doi_registrants_table(). Also leave a note at User talk:Citation bot. I would like to add a free-to-read journal to the DOI prefix list in Module:Citation/CS1/Configuration Module:Citation/CS1/Configuration needs the 10.xxxx/yyyy part of the DOI associated with the journal. All the articles associated with that DOI pattern must be free-to read. Once that is done, the xxxx/yyyy parts can be added to the list under local extended_registrants_t = { with the format ['XXXX'] = {'YYYY'},. If there are multiple journals with the same DOI prefix, they can be grouped together with the format ['XXXX'] = {'YYYY', 'ZZZZ', '...'},. Also leave a note at User talk:Citation bot. I would like to add a geo-dead/geo-access URL keyword Previous discussions have come to the conclusion that this is not workable. Websites change which regions can access them regularly, and these websites are regardless not fundamentally dead. I would like support for PDF page numbers The specific page of a specific PDF may change between clients with the same file or files with the same client. Consider using a |chapter= or |quote= instead. I would like my change done now Local consensus is that these modules sync from their sandboxes approximately once every 3–6 months. This is due to complexity of changes, the number of transclusions these modules have, and to be sure sufficient consensus exists for a change. I don't like (identifier) in the links to identifier pages This is done to differentiate identifier links (... lorem ipsum dolor sit amet.<ref>Linden, David van der. (2015) ... doi:10.18352/dze.10126</ref> ... ) from prose links (... the digital object identifier was introduced in 2000 by ... ) in Special:WhatLinksHere.

• {{cite book |last1=Hiriart-Urruty |first1=Jean-Baptiste |last2=Lemaréchal |first2=Claude |author-link2=Claude Lemaréchal |year=1993 |chapter=XII Abstract duality for practitioners |title=Convex analysis and minimization algorithms, Volume II: Advanced theory and bundle methods |series=Grundlehren der Mathematischen Wissenschaften |trans-series=Fundamental Principles of Mathematical Sciences |volume=306 |publisher=Springer-Verlag |location=Berlin |pages=136–193 (and bibliographical comments on pp. 334–335) |isbn=3-540-56852-2 |mr=1295240}}
• {{cite journal | last1 = Hallgrímsson | first1 = Helgi | last2 = Eyjólfsdóttir | first2 = Guðríður Gyða | date = 2004 | language = Icelandic | title = Íslenskt sveppatal I - smásveppir | trans-title = Checklist of Icelandic Fungi I - Microfungi | journal = Fjölrit Náttúrufræðistofnunar |trans-journal=Polygraph of the Institute of Natural Sciences | publisher = Náttúrufræðistofnun Íslands |trans-publisher=Natural History Institute of Iceland | location = Reykjavík}}

Gives

• Hiriart-Urruty, Jean-Baptiste; Lemaréchal, Claude (1993). "XII Abstract duality for practitioners". Convex analysis and minimization algorithms, Volume II: Advanced theory and bundle methods. Grundlehren der Mathematischen Wissenschaften. Vol. 306. Berlin: Springer-Verlag. pp. 136–193 (and bibliographical comments on pp. 334–335). ISBN 3-540-56852-2. MR 1295240. {{cite book}}: Unknown parameter |trans-series= ignored (help)
• Hallgrímsson, Helgi; Eyjólfsdóttir, Guðríður Gyða (2004). "Íslenskt sveppatal I - smásveppir" [Checklist of Icelandic Fungi I - Microfungi]. Fjölrit Náttúrufræðistofnunar [Polygraph of the Institute of Natural Sciences] (in Icelandic). Reykjavík: Náttúrufræðistofnun Íslands. {{cite journal}}: Unknown parameter |trans-publisher= ignored (help)

Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 16:38, 14 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

A "trans-series" parameter would be helpful. I just came to this page for the same reason—it would be helpful for Rex Raab's 1993 biography cited in the article on Edith Maryon, where "trans-title" works but "trans-series" does not. The former is obviously more important, but the latter would be a bonus. --Usernameunique (talk) 03:52, 30 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

What about |script-publisher= and |script-series=? -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz Username:Chatul (talk) 12:51, 30 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Greetings and felicitations. How specific should a location in a citation be, and what type of abbreviations should be used? I use, for example, "New York", "Los Angeles", "London", and "Beijing", assuming that most Alpha − and Beta + and above cities don't need the administrative division of their location (if they have a separate one) specified, at least not for English literate readers. Similarly, if the publication is a product of a tip-top university which includes the its location in its name, I have been assuming that the location doesn't need its administrative division included (i.e., Oxford and Cambridge). OTOH, I add "The Netherlands" to "Leiden", and am wondering if I should add the county to publishers in the UK, or just use "Placename, UK". If I should use the county (or state, for the US, or province or territory for Canada), do I use the postal abbreviation (e.g, CT), the traditional abbreviation (Conn.), or the whole name (Connecticut)? As, say, in:

• Bolitho, Hector, ed. (1943). A Batsford Century: The Record of a Hundred Years of Publishing and Bookselling, 1843–1943. London; Malvern Wells, UK: B. T. Batsford. OCLC 188389.

"Malvern Wells, UK", "Malvern Wells, Worcs, UK", or "Malvern Wells, Worcestershire, UK"?

Also, do I assume that a reader will know that Dakar is the capital of Bangladesh, or do I include that information (for all capitals of countries below a certain level of prominence)? —DocWatson42 (talk) 08:05, 16 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Edit: Another example: "Jefferson, North Carolina, US", "Jefferson, North Carolina", or "Jefferson, NC"? Or "Jefferson, NC, US" (for McFarland & Company)? —DocWatson42 (talk) 08:10, 16 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Edit 2: And does the uniqueness of a name count (e.g., Indianapolis and Minneapolis)? —DocWatson42 (talk) 08:12, 16 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

|location=Houndmills, Basingstoke, Hampshire, UK |publisher=Palgrave Macmillan or |location=Houndmills, UK |publisher=Palgrave Macmillan or |location=Basingstoke, UK |publisher=Palgrave Macmillan (OCLC 946357865)? —DocWatson42 (talk) 08:20, 16 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

See MOS:STATEABBR for a bit of guidance. – Jonesey95 (talk) 14:02, 18 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Thank you. I read it, but it doesn't apply much to my question, other than to the abbreviations. :-/ —DocWatson42 (talk) 16:15, 23 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Re your two "Edit" entries above, I would choose "Jefferson, North Carolina" and "Indianapolis" based on what happens when I paste those strings into the Wikipedia search bar. – Jonesey95 (talk) 22:45, 24 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

There is that—thank you. I have been thinking of the references outside the context of Wikipedia, as if they were standing on their own. —DocWatson42 (talk) 07:55, 25 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

• 'character' is translatable.

					err_msg = char_name .. ' ' .. 'character';

• 'Wikidata', 'Wikisource' and 'Wikipedia' are translatable.

					local proj_name = ({['d'] = 'Wikidata', ['s'] = 'Wikisource', ['w'] = 'Wikipedia'})[proj];	-- :w (wikipedia) for linking from a non-wikipedia project

• '-name-list parameters' is translatable.

			utilities.set_message ('err_redundant_parameters', err_name .. '-name-list parameters');	-- add error message

• A single space between Minutes and cfg.messages['minutes'] should be optional, since some languages do not require a space between them. For example, in Korean, "23 minutes in" is translated as "23분부터", not "23 분부터". (The same goes for Japanese, where they created separate module for i18n. See ja:Module:Citation/CS-ja and ja:Module:Citation/CS-ja/Configuration)

			Position = " " .. Minutes .. " " .. cfg.messages['minutes'];

• 'citation' (the second one) and 'cite ' are translatable. In addition, in Korean, the 'cite *' series is translated as '* 인용', such as 웹 인용 or 서적 인용. (Same for tr:Şablon:Web kaynağı, etc.) So there should be an option for swtiching the order of 'cite ' and config.CitationClass.

	local template_name = ('citation' == config.CitationClass) and 'citation' or 'cite ' .. (cfg.citation_class_map_t[config.CitationClass] or config.CitationClass);

So, it would be much better if these literal strings were moved to the /configuration and given a slight adjustment to improve i18n. Thanks.--Namoroka (talk) 02:36, 20 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks for finding those. Fixed in the sandbox, I think. Examples in the same order:

for invisible characters:

for interproject wikilink annotations:

For redundant author/editor parameters:

for 'minutes in' in-source location:

for error message, maint message, and preview message annotation ({{cite <whatever>}} same as {{cite book}} annotations above):

—Trappist the monk (talk) 19:12, 21 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Please move also "(empty string)". And cfg.messages['archived-unfit'] should have place-holder. FlatLanguage (talk) 05:10, 26 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

And cfg.messages['inactive']. --FlatLanguage (talk) 06:19, 26 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

'empty string' done:

{{cite book/new |title=Title|=}}

Title. {{cite book}}: Cite has empty unknown parameter: |(empty string)= (help)

I don't know what you mean by place-holder.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 18:20, 4 October 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Hello, there are titles beginning with "This article is more than [time] old " which is not really part of the title and should be removed from the front of the title. Maybe these could be trapped under the generic titles tracking? [time] could be various such as "3 months", "9 years" etc. Keith D (talk) 11:43, 22 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Only about 100 uses. Izno (talk) 21:57, 22 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Another one for consideration - title ending in "- Read free for 30 days". Only about 20 of these. Keith D (talk) 20:52, 26 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

This bot request asking for a bot to address CS1 article number as page number issues is relevant to this page. – Jonesey95 (talk) 12:37, 25 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

|volume= pass through extra_text_in_vol_iss_check() before utilities.hyphen_to_dash(), while |issue= pass through utilities.hyphen_to_dash() before extra_text_in_vol_iss_check(). So accept-as-written markup suppresses err_extra_text_volume but doesn't suppres err_extra_text_issue.

{{cite magazine|title=title |magazine=magazine |volume=((vol. 1)) |number=((no. 2))}}

"title". magazine. Vol. vol. 1, no. no. 2. {{cite magazine}}: |number= has extra text (help)

Should we be consistent? --FlatLanguage (talk) 14:38, 25 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

The solution here is to not duplicate the template's functionality and use |volume=1 and |number=2. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 16:24, 25 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

The solution for what? Will that make the hidden error appear? FlatLanguage (talk) 16:39, 25 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

That will not cause an error to begin with. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 16:55, 25 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Fixed in sandbox: en:Special:Diff/1313422909

--FlatLanguage (talk) 04:06, 26 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Bad timestamp in |archive-url= makes a script error.

{{cite book|title=title |url=https://example.com |archive-url=https://web.archive.org/web/20209999000000/https://example.com |archive-date=2020-01-01}}

title. Archived from the original on 2020-01-01. {{cite book}}: |archive-date= / |archive-url= timestamp mismatch; 2020-99-99 suggested (help)

{{cite book|title=title |url=https://example.com |archive-url=https://web.archive.org/web/20209999000000/https://example.com |archive-date=1 Jan 2020}}

Lua error in Module:Citation/CS1/Date_validation at line 986: bad argument #3 to 'format' (string expected, got nil).

This is from reformat_dates() without check_date(). Should we avoid script errors? I fixed like this, but this is temporary solution. --FlatLanguage (talk) 14:56, 25 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Fixed in the sandbox, I think:

invalid date portion of the archive.org timestamp:

{{cite book/new |title=title |url=https://example.com |archive-url=https://web.archive.org/web/20209999000000/https://example.com |archive-date=1 Jan 2020}}

title. {{cite book}}: |archive-url= is malformed: timestamp (help)

valid date portion of the archive.org timestamp:

{{cite book/new |title=title |url=https://example.com |archive-url=https://web.archive.org/web/20200101000000/https://example.com |archive-date=1 Jan 2020}}

title. Archived from the original on 1 Jan 2020.

invalid date portion of the archive.today timestamp:

{{cite book/new |title=title |url=https://example.com |archive-url=https://archive.today/20209999000000/https://example.com |archive-date=1 Jan 2020}}

title. {{cite book}}: |archive-url= is malformed: timestamp (help)

valid date portion of the archive.today timestamp:

{{cite book/new |title=title |url=https://example.com |archive-url=https://archive.today/20200101000000/https://example.com |archive-date=1 Jan 2020}}

title. Archived from the original on 1 Jan 2020.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 23:07, 25 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Tagging a source with the ISO 639 code sac leaves a maintenance error (Category:CS1 maint: unrecognized language), and neither Sac nor Fox are recognized. See, for example, Fox language#Further reading. Is there an override we should do on Wikipedia, or should I take it up with the boffins at Mediawiki? Snowman304|talk 18:17, 27 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Maintenance messages are not error messages. Because cs1|2 uses MeadiaWiki for language tag/name support, MediaWiki support for sac will have to come from them.

Don't hold your breath. If I think I understand where MediaWiki gets language names/tags, if is from Unicode CLDR; mayhaps here?

When the language tag is not recognized, use the language name and ignore the maint message.

—Trappist the monk (talk) 19:17, 27 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Gotcha! Seems like they're missing quite a few languages on that list. Snowman304|talk 16:05, 28 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

This should display an error/maintenance message of some kind, e.g.

• Stoll, Hans R. (2006). "Electronic Trading in Stock Markets". Journal of Economic Perspectives. 20 (1): 153–174. doi:10.1257/089533006776526067.

This is nonsense. If the DOI is free, then it shouldn't have a pay-to-read link there. And 9 times out of 10 |url-access=subscription is just completely erreneous. This should emit an error/maintenance category so it can be cleaned up to a proper

• Stoll, Hans R. (2006). "Electronic Trading in Stock Markets". Journal of Economic Perspectives. 20 (1): 153–174. doi:10.1257/089533006776526067.

Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 20:10, 28 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

And while it might have been answered here before - pretty please, add that explanation to the documentation of templates that use this paramter (like Template:Cite web). It should be obvious from readng the doc (and it very much isn't now; as in - why use this field if the Chinese etc. scripts display perfectly fine in regular title field?). _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 02:40, 30 September 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Ctrl + F finds the following (eventually) in the cited template documentation:

script-title: Original title for languages that do not use a Latin-based script (Arabic, Chinese, Cyrillic, Greek, Hebrew, Japanese, Korean, etc); follows Romanization defined in title (if present). Must be prefixed with one of the supported language codes to help browsers properly display the script:
... |title=Tōkyō tawā |script-title=ja:東京タワー |trans-title=Tokyo Tower ...

I suppose we might adjust this to say that script-title is only needed when italics would otherwise be output (which may be a general adjustment), as CS1 might for the name of a book or website. Izno (talk) 03:05, 1 October 2025 (UTC)[reply]

One thing I hate about the |script parameters is that they strip things like quotation marks from article titles. Snowman304|talk 00:32, 4 October 2025 (UTC)[reply]

I've noticed that and I'm pretty sure I'd come to the conclusion it probably shouldn't do that. You should make a new section for it. Izno (talk) 17:40, 8 October 2025 (UTC)[reply]

In addition to avoiding italics for Chinese characters etc in book titles, this allows one to also give the romanized title in |title=. Kanguole 07:30, 1 October 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Template:Cite web#csdoc_script-title. --Redrose64 🌹 (talk) 20:16, 1 October 2025 (UTC)[reply]

@Izno @Redrose64 I did see that, but I did not realize italics would be a problem - this needs to be clearly explained in the text. Should title field be empty for Chinese and similar languages? This is very much still uncledar to me (and there is even an error prompt when saving the template about title field being empty). _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 02:49, 2 October 2025 (UTC)[reply]

PS. I noticed this problem when c/e a ref here. In the past I've always seen and included Chinese / Korean titles in the title field, and I can't recall I've ever seen this parameter used until today. _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 02:50, 2 October 2025 (UTC)[reply]

A week later and I still don't know when to use this. A lot of my students are adding Chinese and Korean sources, and I am telling them to use the title, not script, field, and nothing in our rules tells me I am giving them bad advice (since the title field does not say not to use non-latin scripts in it). _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 07:29, 9 October 2025 (UTC)[reply]

In order to be most helpful to readers not familiar with the script, I suggest that the documentation should recommend that titles in non-Latin scripts should be placed in |script-title=, with a romanization in |title=. Kanguole 08:18, 9 October 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Indeed; but we also should have a way to dynamically fix it - a pop up or such when saving a template with non-Latin characters in the title parameter. Otherwise next to nobody will be doing this, as it is counter-intuitive not to have a title in the, well, title parameter. Plus we have the "trans-title" parameter, for translating the, well, title, not the "trans-script-title"... Frankly, I don't undestand the technical problem of not being able to handle non-Latin stuff in title field. I've never seen any problem with the non-Latin stuff in that field. _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 10:02, 9 October 2025 (UTC)[reply]

I'll second this; I've used plenty of Cyrillic in the title field w/o any issues. Or is the idea non-Latin script in the script field, transliterated title in the title field and translated title in trans-title? If so then that should be made much clearer.--Sturmvogel 66 (talk) 11:29, 9 October 2025 (UTC)[reply]

@Sturmvogel 66 "Bah, editors should figure that out by using wiki telepathy. The person who designed that field had a good idea how to use it - why can't everyone else?" :P _{Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here} 12:36, 9 October 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Something like

 <ref>{{cite book
 | title        = Luach Ha-pe'alim Ha-shalem
 | script-title = he:לוח הפעלים השלם
 | trans-title  = The complete verb table
 | author       = Dr. Shaul Barkali 
 | publisher    = Levine/Millenniu
 }}
</ref>

Rendering as this^[1] and creating metadata for the Hebrew title. -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz Username:Chatul (talk) 12:54, 9 October 2025 (UTC)[reply]

 You are invited to join the discussion at Wikipedia:Bots/Noticeboard § Is Monkbot 21 removing url-status=dead desirable?. Dan Leonard (talk • contribs) 19:46, 8 October 2025 (UTC)[reply]